Interview with Sabra Lane, ABC AM

SABRA LANE: Chris Bowen is the Federal Minister for Climate Change and Energy. Chris Bowen thanks for talking to AM. You famously said in 2019 of an ALP policy then, if voters didn’t like it, don’t vote for us. Is that what they should do now? There is a very clear policy choice on offer.

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, I’m not sure you’d call it a policy choice, Sabra, given what the opposition released yesterday could not really be called a policy, given its key elements are missing. But there’s a very clear distinction here between the government, which is getting on with the plans and rolling out 82 per cent renewable across our grid, which is more reliable, as we increasingly need to move away from unreliable ageing coal-fired power stations, and the opposition, who wants to pause that in the vain hope of a nuclear fantasy coming on, on their own timetable, which would be hugely ambitious, for 2035, 2037 and to not –

SABRA LANE: Sorry, to the nub of that question, if they don’t like the government’s policy, they should vote for them [coalition].

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, this election is a choice. It is a real choice between two different energy policies: our energy policy which we’ve been very clear about implementing and their fantasy which they can’t answer key questions on. I mean, if you can’t explain – let alone the cost, Sabra – how many megawatts or gigawatts we’re going to get from these nuclear reactors. They’re saying two small reactors. No commercial small modular reactor operates anywhere in the world. Mr Dutton yesterday put up a picture of one which was a computer-generated concept drawing. I mean, that is not a policy. But you are right; there is a clear choice at this election.

SABRA LANE: There is dissatisfaction in parts of the community with the transition to clean energy with building of hundreds of kilometres of new powerlines, offshore wind farms, high prices. Do you concede that the bumpy rollout and perhaps poor community consultation have resulted in many people losing faith in renewable power?

CHRIS BOWEN: Look, this is obviously a controversial area and there are some projects which are more controversial than others. There are some which are more supported, like offshore wind for Gippsland and indications are, for example, Bass Strait, two very, very big offshore wind zones which will generate a lot of energy; more contested in other areas. And you are right, we have needed to improve the consultation process. The consultation process we inherited was not fit for purpose and we have made key steps to improve it. But against that, Sabra, we saw seven sites announced yesterday with no consultation –

SABRA LANE: Again, let’s go to the nub of the question though.

CHRIS BOWEN: This is a choice, Sabra. This is a choice, with respect, this is a choice –

SABRA LANE: It is a choice but also there was a key question.

CHRIS BOWEN: If I could just make this point quickly, Sabra. Seven sites announced yesterday. The Deputy Leader of the National Party said, “If the communities don’t want the sites, we won’t proceed.” The Leader of the National Party said, “That’s not right” and then Senator McKenzie of the National Party said, “We haven’t actually really nominated any sites.” I mean, this is a mess.

SABRA LANE: Power is costing people a lot of money now. The government has had to help out with energy rebates last financial year and the new financial year to come. Mr Albanese promised that energy prices would be reduced by $275 a year from 2025. In hindsight, was that perhaps a bit foolish to make that promise?

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, that was the result of the modelling of our policies and, again, no modelling from our opponents yesterday or yet, and they will not say whether they will release any before the election –

SABRA LANE: But to the point of the question –

CHRIS BOWEN: Here is a fact: renewables are the cheapest form of energy. We’re getting more in and that means cheaper power prices. Yes, we’ve had to do that against the context of a war in Ukraine which has seen power prices rocket around the world, and that was an unknown factor at that time and that has in every country around the world is making this transition and communication about this transition more difficult. I accept that point. But it doesn’t make it less important.

SABRA LANE: Is Labor in danger of miscalculating your opposition here? Labor thought the public would never elect Tony Abbott or Scott Morrison and they did. They might well choose Peter Dutton and the nuclear plan at the next election.

CHRIS BOWEN: There is certainly not an ounce of complacency in the government, Sabra. If you’re suggesting there is, I would respectfully disagree. We take every vote very, very seriously. Every election is winnable or losable. But we will be prosecuting the case for sticking with the plan and avoiding the risk that goes with an uncosted, unfunded, unmodelled nuclear plan which assumes new technologies will come online which haven’t come online for the last 40 years, like small modular reactors. And the risk, Sabra, is by sweating the assets of our coal fired power stations, making them operate for longer and they become increasingly unreliable, it’s a risk Mr Dutton wants to impose; it means higher emissions, higher bills and higher unreliability. Mr Dutton wants to talk about that policy, we are happy to talk about that policy.

SABRA LANE: Chris Bowen, thanks for talking to AM.

CHRIS BOWEN: Good on you, Sabra.