Interview with Sarah Abo, Sunrise Nine

SARAH ABO: Welcome back. Well Aussie families are forking out an extra $3,000 at the supermarket every year according to new research. The cost of staples surging by 30 per cent during the Albanese Government's first term.

Joining us to discuss today's headlines is Minister for Climate Change and Energy Chris Bowen, and Nationals Senator Bridget McKenzie. Good morning to you both.

Chris, I'll start with you. So an extra $3,000 a year. We know families are already hurting. How do you justify that?

CHRIS BOWEN: Good morning, Sarah, good morning, Bridget. Well, it just shows the importance of ongoing cost of living relief and that's what we've been focussed on, whether it's our tax cuts for every single tax paying Australian that Bridget and her party opposed, or our $300 energy bill relief, or cheaper childcare or cheaper medicines or fee free TAFE.

All this has been very, very important to help Australians through. We've done a lot; we've done all of this in our first term. We need to keep going in our second term to provide ongoing cost of living relief, as people right around the world are dealing with a cost-of-living crisis.

Now we have to deal with it, we have been dealing with it. There is an alternative just to complain and not provide cost of living relief, which is what the Opposition's been doing. What we've been doing is focussed on really providing practical, meaningful help for families over the last three years.

SARAH ABO: They might not be feeling it though, Chris, that's the issue when the prices are going up so significantly at the supermarket. I mean, Bridget, there are obviously -

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, I -

SARAH ABO: Various factors at play including supply issues. Was a rise like this potentially inevitable or are there other reasons for it?

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Well, Sarah, this is the reality for everyday Australians, the shame of getting to the checkout and having to put back products that you and your family need, only focussing on essentials. And Australians have got range of strategies to deal with Labor's cost of living crisis.

Chris talks about global factors but the reality is when you compare our nation to other countries around the globe, inflation has been higher for longer than it needed to be, and that means your groceries have gone through the roof because your energy, energy costs across the economy have gone through the roof. Insurance has gone up; your mortgages have gone up.

All across the board, these increased input costs mean that food's gone up and we really need to restore discipline to Government spending so we can actually get inflation under control and see prices start to drop. Chris needs to take responsibility because Australians are really, really hurting.

SARAH ABO: What would you have done differently though, Bridget? How could you have prevented this rise on supermarket shelves?

BRIDGET McKENZIE: When you look at what the experts say, they say that inflation has remained higher than it needed to be in Australia because the Labor Party has got Government spending out of control. So we would be restoring discipline to the federal budget, cutting wasteful spending, and ensuring that just like Australians are having to do when they go to the supermarket, only spending hard earned taxpayers' dollars on the things that are essential at a Federal Government level, rather than the wasteful spending that we've seen under Labor.

CHRIS BOWEN: Bridget, what would you cut? Would you cut in our investment in Medicare bulk billing, would you cut our -

BRIDGET McKENZIE: We wouldn't have spent $450 million -  

CHRIS BOWEN: Support for -

BRIDGET McKENZIE: On the failed Voice referendum. You need to start focussing on Australians, Chris.

CHRIS BOWEN: Would you cut our support for bulk billing?

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Not your pet projects.

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, are you calling bulk billing, Medicare a pet project, or 20 per cent discount for people who have got a uni debt -

BRIDGET McKENZIE: I call wasting $450 million on the failed Voice -

CHRIS BOWEN: A pet project?

SARAH ABO: The Coalition has said it will match your spending on Medicare.

CHRIS BOWEN: Yeah.

BRIDGET McKENZIE: We're guaranteeing Medicare, Chris, stop running a scare campaign.

CHRIS BOWEN: Yeah, and you promised a second referendum, Bridget, so -

SARAH ABO: Well, all right, because this all sort of comes -

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, you just said you're going to cut government spending -

SARAH ABO: I just want to move on because this is -

BRIDGET McKENZIE: No, I did not.

SARAH ABO: This is related. Chris Richardson, one of our top economists   

CHRIS BOWEN: You just said it. Your whole answer was you're going to cut Government spending.

SARAH ABO: Chris, Chris Richardson, one of our top economists -

CHRIS BOWEN: Your whole answer.

SARAH ABO: In this country says that Labor is too reliant on taxing workers. I suppose that's the way you are able to provide some relief. But The Australian this morning is reporting that last financial year Australians paid something like $3,500 more in tax, what do you say to that?

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, Chris Richardson's report, again, I mean I've read it, I've read the report in The Fin this morning, and he goes through policies he's not happy with, including our investment in Medicare, including our 20 per cent debt relief for uni students, including our support for the town of Whyalla, including $300 energy bill relief. All of this he says he's against. Okay, fair enough, he's entitled to that view. We strongly disagree.

We've taken two big Liberal deficits and turned them into two Labor surpluses, all   

SARAH ABO: Are you too reliant on Australians, on taxing Australians though for that?

CHRIS BOWEN: Well, we've delivered surpluses, which the Liberals talked about and had mugs and all sorts of things and never could actually deliver, we've delivered them at the same time as delivering improved support for families. And Bridget's whole answer just then was about how they're going to cut Government spending, but she couldn't provide a single answer of things that they'll take to the next election to cut.

So what is the real Liberal policy here? We're going to keep focussed on delivering tax relief for Australians. And to your question about tax, we have just delivered a tax cut for every single tax paying Australian. Peter Dutton was so angry about it he called for an election 12 months ago to try and stop it.

So we're the party that's actually now delivering tax cuts. The Liberal Party and the National Party that Bridget's a member of are just completely all over the shop when it comes to tax relief for Australians.

SARAH ABO: You are promising tax cuts though apparently though, Bridget, is that right?

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Yeah, we're delivering a lower tax guarantee at the next Federal election. The data is correct, Australians are paying more tax under the Labor Party and that's only going to grow. We've got $3,500 extra tax and I think Labor's using the back door - 

SARAH ABO: All right, how are you going to -  

BRIDGET McKENZIE: The back door of bracket creep, Sarah.

SARAH ABO: Yep, how are you going to -

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Which is making Australians poorer over time.

SARAH ABO: How are you going to save, how are you going to save that $3,500 that you say is the excess tax?

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Well we're going to have much more to say about our lower tax guarantee as we head into the election.

SARAH ABO: But you can't say anything right now?

BRIDGET McKENZIE: But that is the reality. That is the reality and the data from economists says that Australians are paying more tax as a proportion of the Federal Government, and if Chris was really interested in cost of living relief he'd be putting more of their own money back into their pockets, which they haven't been doing. And this is only going to grow over coming years.

We know that Australians'   

CHRIS BOWEN: That's called a tax cut, Bridget.

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Income is going to be back to 2021- 

SARAH ABO: But, Bridget, you haven't given us, you haven't defined -

CHRIS BOWEN: [Indistinct] Bridget.

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Levels until 2030.

SARAH ABO:  A single way your going to give back on tax yet.

BRIDGET McKENZIE: So until - Sarah, Australians are going to be feeling poorer for longer because they actually are according to the data, and they're not going to - 

SARAH ABO: How are you going to make them feel richer?

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Get back to a 2021 income kind of standard of living until into the 2030s. Thank you, Chris, and your failed economic policies.

SARAH ABO: All right.

CHRIS BOWEN: I've got no idea what Bridget just said. I just listened to that, and she called for tax cuts at the same time and was opposing tax cuts. I've got no idea what she was just talking about, sorry. I can't respond to something which makes no sense.

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Australians' living standards have fallen, Chris, under you -  

SARAH ABO: I think we're going to   

BRIDGET McKENZIE: And you've got no plan to fix it.

SARAH ABO: -And that is true. Look, it has been a difficult period for a lot of Australians - 

CHRIS BOWEN: Bridget, did you support the tax cut - 

SARAH ABO:  With the cost of living crisis, but we are -

CHRIS BOWEN: We just delivered, or do you deny it happened?

SARAH ABO: Running out of time. All right, guys, we're going to have to continue this another day. I'm sure we will firm up some policies by then. Thank you both so much for joining me this morning.

BRIDGET McKENZIE: Thanks Sarah.