Interview with Greg Jennett, ABC Afternoon Briefing

GREG JENNETT: We have been talking today about the shaky path towards Australia's carbon reduction targets. Jenny McAllister, as Assistant Minister for Energy and Climate Change, is responsible for some of this. She joined us here a little earlier.

Jenny McAllister, welcome back to the program. So, Jim Chalmers gave a speech late last week warning of problems making the net zero commitment by 2050 on current settings. He's flagging the need for more investment to get there, both public and private. Do you know how much more?

JENNY MCALLISTER: I think I read Jim's speech a little differently, Greg. I mean, I think he was pointing to two things. One is that in the near term to 2030, we need to grapple with some challenges in our energy system that, frankly, we inherited from the previous government who failed to land an energy policy during their entire period in office. There is a longer-term opportunity, though, that we need to keep our eye on, which is establishing Australia as a renewable energy superpower. That means building up industries in areas like green metals, hydrogen production, battery production, critical mineral refining, and that's going to require substantial focus from government. There's enormous opportunity, but it requires real effort. And I think the point Jim was making was, yes, it will require investment, public and private, but it'll need us to attend to the other parts of government policy as well. Skills and training, research and development, the regulatory environments, the competitive settings in the economy. Jim's speech really tried to bring all of those things together, I think, and paint a picture about the broad economic reform agenda that's required to take us from where we are now, 2023, right through to 2050.

GREG JENNETT: And is that already factored in, or will it be soon into your own budget commitments in this area? Even if you leave the extra elements like skills off to one side, even the incentivising of investment by the private sector is that money already found?

JENNY MCALLISTER: There’s significant investment in Labor's existing budget settings. So, we estimate around $40 billion dedicated to that renewable energy superpower proposition. That is, things like Rewiring the Nation. It's things like the Capacity Investment Scheme, which seeks to bring forward storage and batteries. It's things like, of course, the money allocated into the Reconstruction Fund, which seeks to support the establishment of new industries.

GREG JENNETT: You're saying you'll need more, way more, over and above that figure?

JENNY MCALLISTER: Public and private investment in the years to come, I think the Treasurer makes the sensible point that not only do we have to generate the capital, but we need to make sure that it's deployed in efficient and effective ways through the economy. And that is a broader proposition than just the finance.

GREG JENNETT: In the near term, even into the medium term, if we are to reach either 2030, and then 2050 targets, is it likely that the main tool at your disposal, which is the Safeguard Mechanism, will have to do more than originally envisaged? More in reducing carbon that's been modelled so far?

JENNY MCALLISTER: The Safeguard Mechanism was a really important reform. It covers only a part of the emissions in the Australian economy and it's presently calibrated to ensure that that part of the economy makes its contribution to our emissions reductions. But across the economy more generally, we are going to need to do significant work to make it to 2050. The important thing here, though, is that we get the broad policy settings right. The government has recently announced our intention to develop six sector plans going to some of those really important sectors, like transport, like the building sector, like the industrial sector - working with our stakeholders and partners in industry, in the community to map out that pathway towards 2050.

GREG JENNETT: And will that all be done this side of the next election

JENNY MCALLISTER: The safeguard - sorry, the sector plans are intended to be developed, I think, over the next sort of 18 months, so that work's been set in train.

GREG JENNETT: All right, let's move to something that I think you have oversight on, a scheme known as Climate Active. You're going to revamp it. More than 550 businesses have voluntarily been involved in this up to now, it's about them pledging to reduce their emissions. If you're revamping it, how much have you assessed the gains, I think they're 38 million tonnes of carbon emissions so far calculated, have been dodgy in their carbon accounting?

JENNY MCALLISTER: We really welcome the participation of businesses in this scheme and for the context of your viewers, Greg, the businesses are really diverse, so they're enterprises like childcare centres, some local governments, some much larger entities. And we know that over the last decade, they've made real contributions in reducing their own emissions. But community expectations about this are changing, the program is now more than a decade old and it is time to upgrade the standards. And we want consumers to know that when they purchase a product from a business that says that it's Climate Active, they can be really confident that the emissions claimed, the emissions reductions claimed, are real and genuine. And that's what we're consulting on at the moment.

GREG JENNETT: You want to also, just in language terms, move on from the phrase carbon neutral, What's wrong with that?

JENNY MCALLISTER: Look, the advice that we're receiving is that the focus the community is seeking is more on emissions reductions at the premises. And so, we're presently consulting with businesses and the community about the approach they'd like us to take. But we've put forward a proposal which would require participating businesses to reduce their own emissions on site, as well as some of the other offsetting arrangements they might enter into.

GREG JENNETT: Okay, so if it's more onerous on them and the goal is to reduce emissions overall, it's reasonable to presume, isn't it, and does the government presume, that there'll be fewer businesses volunteering to fall within this net? Fewer than 540 anyway?

JENNY MCALLISTER: We'll see how it goes. I mean, we've got two things at play here. We've got a much stronger interest from the community and business in participating. But also, a requirement that these kinds of consumer certifications be really robust. I think we'll continue to see business interest and consumer interest in these kinds of programs expand.

GREG JENNETT: All right, well, we've reached what I think we're calling the halfway term, roughly speaking, within this parliament. So, that makes it valid to start asking questions about polls, I think, Jenny McAllister. Newspoll has Labor's primary vote down to 35 per cent. How much of this is a direct consequence of too much political capital being invested unsuccessfully in the Voice?

JENNY MCALLISTER: I don't comment on polls, and there are a range of good reasons for that. But the most important of them is that when you are offered the privilege of governing and for serving the Australian people, you should give your every focus to that task. And that is, in fact, the task, that's the opportunity that we have. We went to the election promising that we would deliver a referendum on the Voice, and we kept that promise --

GREG JENNETT: At cost.

JENNY MCALLISTER: But we promised a lot of other things too, including really bringing focus to the pressures that we're bearing on Australian families. And I think you've seen it in our agenda, providing cost of living relief through energy policies, through cheaper medicines, expanding bulk billing, getting wages moving. These things remain important for areas of focus for our government as well.

GREG JENNETT: And was that obscured at all by the Voice?

JENNY MCALLISTER: I think Australians have seen us working very hard on the things that matter to them, and I think they also understand that it's important to keep your promises.

GREG JENNETT: All right, well, we'll be sparing in our questions on polling, I can assure you. We don't willingly go there often, but we'll keep an eye on it in the background. Jenny McAllister, great to talk to you.

JENNY MCALLISTER: Thanks, Greg.