Interview with Sean Murphy, ABC

SEAN MURPHY (HOST): Nuclear is just one option in the mix when it comes to the energy translation. Of course, Labor are committed to a different path with an emphasis on renewable options. To talk about this and related, Assistant Minister for Climate Change and Energy Josh Wilson joins me now to talk through the Government's plans. Good morning, Mr. Wilson.

JOSH WILSON: Good morning, Sean. How are you?

MURPHY: Well, indeed. We're just off the back of playing some Mariah Carey, All I want for Christmas is you. So, I'm buoyed, even if some listeners might be slightly in the cringe. What do you see as the future looking like for coal reliant towns like us here in Muswellbrook?

WILSON: Well, we're going through a period of change because coal-fired power stations are coming to the end of their life, and we need to see our energy system turn into the sort of the next form of itself. From Australia's point of view, that should be being a renewable energy superpower, because that's our comparative advantage, because we have the best renewable resources in the world. We've got the technology, the innovation, the entrepreneurship, the skilled workforce, all of the things that should enable us to seize the opportunities that are, that are occurring globally. And I think it's really exciting. It's obviously not without challenges. My sense from colleagues in NSW is that places like the Hunter are taking that on, communities are taking that on because they can already see that we've made huge progress with renewable energy. I mean, NSW has gone from 10% to 36% inside the last 10 years. And they're seeing the reality of solar PV on their own homes. You know, we're kind of at the point now with more than a third of Australians already making that switch themselves. People know that the opportunity to have cleaner and cheaper energy is before us. We just have to seize it with both hands.

MURPHY: So, there's been an inexorable rise of sustainable energy being fed into the grid, and yet even faster power prices go up. It seems like policymakers, whether they are on the sustainable energy side or on the nuclear energy side, whatever it may be, there are big plans, there's great excitement at the policy level, and yet for the consumer, ultimately the bills just keep getting dearer. Will this actually ever change, or do we just have to accept the fact that we're in a time of expensive power and it's just going to keep going up no matter what the source?

WILSON: Well, look, Australians have experienced some tough times when it comes to energy prices over the last couple of years, and that continues even though those prices have moderated more recently. I think most people understand that there have been some specific circumstances, particularly the war in Ukraine and the energy crisis that resulted.

MURPHY: But surely if we're an energy superpower in the making, things like the war in Ukraine, as we feed more and more sustainable energy into the mix, are less relevant?

WILSON: Well, that's absolutely right, and that's why we have to get there. Obviously, when you're at sort of 35 to 40% renewable energy, we've got a fair way to go. That's why the government has put us on the path to 82% renewables by 2030. But most people who have been able to put solar PV on their house will have a direct experience of how that makes their own energy more affordable. And that's the kind of change that we want to see in the energy system as a whole, because not everybody is in a position to put solar PV on their house. If you happen to be someone who lives in an apartment, that's not an easy choice for you. But we're also introducing programmes that expand the access to renewable energy to more housing types, with a particular focus in some of the work I've been doing on social housing tenants through our Social Housing Energy Performance Initiative, for example. So, we're going through a time of transition, and I think Australians understand that. What they don't need, though, is people coming along and selling them a pup, you know, selling them some sort of con, some sort of fantasy about how there's – there isn't a challenge, there's just some cheap and easy nuclear fantasy that Peter Dutton can wave a wand and turn everything into magic and bubbles the day after. And the latest report from CSIRO and AEMO, which came out this week, makes it crystal clear that that is not in Australia's best interest. That is the most expensive form of energy. And if we were to go down that path, it would mean very, very significant delays, chaos, costs, risks and all of the things that nuclear has unfortunately delivered.

MURPHY: So, yourself and the Labor Party are pretty clear in terms of your position on the coalition's nuclear proposal. What's the point of today's visit to Muswellbrook, then? Is it going to be a community forum where various views are going to be welcomed, or will it be a rearticulation of what you've just said there?

WILSON: Oh, no. I mean, look, the committee process that's occurring is like all committee processes. It's open for people to come and have their say and provide their input, either in person or through submissions and we've had a fair few of those over the years and they're good. That's how we should approach these topics openly, with people making their own arguments. At the end of the day, of course, it's not just what any individual might say. It should be based on evidence and facts, economics, engineering and expertise. And as I referenced before, you know, on the one hand you have Peter Dutton who wants to sort of tell people some things that are, that are pretty fanciful frankly, about nuclear energy in terms of when it can be delivered and how much it will cost. And on the other hand you've got independent high integrity organisations like CSIRO and AEMO who just delivered their sixth report making it crystal clear that the cheapest path forward for Australia is to invest in firm renewables, which we are doing, and that if we were to slip down another path, we were to wait for 12, 13, 15, maybe longer years before getting nuclear power, we would really face a pretty serious crisis and Australian households would face very significant cost imposts.

MURPHY: Well, Josh Wilson, Assistant Minister for Climate Change and Energy, thanks for your time today. In case people are able to head along to today's committee. Where and when is it happening in Muswellbrook?

WILSON: Well, look, I encourage people to go onto the website which will have the committee hearing details in Muswellbrook. If people have intended to go and appear before the committee, that's something they will have arranged already in order to take up slots in the committee diary. People give that indication, and some preference is given to people who have provided submissions. So, I think that schedule will have been outlined. But I would encourage people to go to the committee website, the committee secretariat website which will have all those details.

MURPHY: Thanks for your time this morning and season's greetings.

WILSON: Thanks Sean.